| August 11, 1992 |
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| Narrator: Caribel Washington |
| Interviewer: Jack Muirhead |
| Date: August 11, 1992 |
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| JM |
I'm asking Mrs. Washington to tell us about the last fifty or sixty years of living in Bloomington. We'll start with your memories of the Depression and let you work on up to the present. |
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| CW |
I remember the Depression clearly because our father died at the very beginning of the Depression, and there were three girls of us and we were in high school. We found it very difficult to get through school and to live. There were no jobs for Black people because when the economy was lost then most all the working Black people had no jobs. That was the time when Black people lost everything, really, that they had because with no money they were unable to pay their taxes or to keep their homes going. Any progress that Blacks have made has been since the Depression. They have been able to restore some of their homes and to accumulate things that were lost during the Depression. The war years, the Second World War that is, saw a great change in theeconomy and saw many Black people come into this area because of the work situation. There were war contracts with Eureka Williams. I believe it was still Eureka Williams at that time. They had to use draftees who were too old to go into the active army. So there were many Black people who worked for Williams although they worked in menial jobs for the most part which led in later years to machinists, but in the early years they were not into machinist jobs. The war did a great deal, I think, for most people. It opened up work everywhere.In the government even during the Depression, after the government begun to make changes, we saw many people go to Springfield to secure work that way. After the war things became a little shaky because many of the men coming back felt like they had the right to have jobs and employment and living conditions equal to anyone else because they had worked hard during the war. Had given a great deal of both time and energy in the war only to find out that things had not really opened up like they should have for Black people. So there was a time of stress, I think, with people very impatient to advance, but not having the opportunities because employment had not really opened up at that time.But we saw the sixties come with the great emphasis on civil rights. There were groups who had been working. I was connected with the YWCA, and the women there were very adamant about attempting to secure Black saleswomen in stores or to open up the lunch counters and restaurants to Black people. Up until that time, they were not able to go in and sit down and enjoy a meal unless they were with someone white. One was never, to my knowledge, refused if they were with a white person. Otherwise, they could not eat. All of that changed, of course, with the sit-ins and the marches-all of the protest that happened during Martin Luther King's time until the Civil Rights Act was passed. Of course, that then changed a great many things, and then the Equal Opportunity Program and the pretty much open door to work for people because they were no longer required to ask the race questions anyway in employment. So we saw many, many people come in to General Electric which started in the early fifties. There in [19]53, [19]54, and [19]55 they moved into full production in their plant out on Veterans Parkway, and then many Black men and women had work at General Electric. State Farm after the Civil Rights [legislation] begun to bring in "choice" people. And I say choice people because they picked the best they could find in the colleges, the graduating seniors. To bring them in and train them then for work. There was however a small thrust from one of the personnel men who had a Black intern program among the local people which enabled some of the younger people to start work even before that. But this was a bit touchy because some departments did not want to hire Black people and would refuse. And they were given that right until the time of the Civil Rights Act. Of course, education changed too during that time regarding at least Normal University. I can't speak too much for Wesleyan. I can recall that Dr. Bone was the president of Normal when they were to bring in the first Black professor. And when he came to town and found out that living conditions were such that he could not buy a home were he wanted to, he just left. He felt like he could not subject his children who had lived in an open society to come meet the prejudicial attitudes of the people in this society. So they lost their first one. I can't tell you who came after that because at one time there was a community committee at Normal, and many people belonging to this committee were able to bring connection with the university with the community which worked very well in those days. I don't know whatever happened to it because it goes, I guess, like the way of all things-each person has their own idea of what they would like to do. Since employment opened, I think in this area Black people have lived as well as could be expected under the circumstances because it's always been common knowledge that they didn't get paid as well. Nor were they advanced as often in jobs as the whites were, but they have had work. And I believe in late years, and I can only judge by what I know about State Farm and GTE, more Black people are getting an opportunity in managerial areas that they did not have before. Of course, the economy in this area is better than most anyway. So that probably relates to Black people having more work, and in some cases more prestige in the work they do than they would have in other places. |
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| JM |
I have some questions that I would like to ask you Mrs. Washington. Do you remember if there were sit-ins here or not? |
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| CW |
The NAACP did some protesting. Merlin Kennedy, who was the president of the NAACP during the those years, protested-that group protested, they marched, they wanted a Black Santa Claus in the parade and were refused, they tried to open up barbershops and were not successful, they did some bit of restaurant/lunch counter sit-ins. So yes, there was to some extent, and there was a group at the university, too, that sort of went along and cooperated in that sort of thing. I don't know that any grave results came of it, but at least it did publicize the fact that these problems exist. |
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| JM |
Do you remember what years that would have been approximately? |
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| CW |
Well, not really. I'd have to look back, but that was during the sixties. That was when the marches were going on in the South. The students were for the most part cooperative-I don't say cooperative as much as the ringleaders in the revolts and the protests, but no it was all during the time of Martin Luther King. |
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| JM |
Then changes occurred here as a result of... |
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| CW |
I think most changes that came came because they were forced to change in the equal opportunity measures that forced business and industry to hire people. That's the time of probably the greatest advancement in civil r rights. These days we wonder if it has gone backwards because we see many things that have changed. Subtly sometimes. Underground sometimes. I don't think that as many people are as interested in good race relations as there used to be. You used to find many people siding with it. These days what not necessarily frightens me, but make me anxious is that we would see the Ku Klux Klan and some of the other separatist groups really openly marching and protesting and even David Duke to go so far as to try to be the president. To think that kind of attitude exists in a free country is amazing, I think. And yet it happens because we're so free that oftentimes freedom is detrimental, I think, but then we have to all be free to speak and to act as we think as long as we are not injuring other people. |
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| JM |
Do you see other areas locally where there seems to be a retreat?You've mentioned some of the national political things and the fact that there doesn't seem to be as much support. |
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| CW |
I think we see it when we hear that in the schools there's Black-white confrontation which concerns me, and I'm sure it concerns most right thinking people, but when we have it not only in our colleges, but in our high school and grade school. These confrontations among the young, I think, worry me because you wonder how can this be if everyone is thinking of progress. And it's been said before and probably holds true that no one progresses as long as you're holding others down because you are not advancing if they aren't advancing too. There are many things that are open, but there are also many things that I think could stand improvement a lot. Sometimes in the streets you see an attitude. You know, just body language and reaction of people sometimes that there is a resentment there. And then when you hear of reverse discrimination when other people begin to think that Blacks have had too many favors and are getting too much advancement to their detriment that hasn't been as successful as it could be. Where to go from here is sort of questionable because you wonder where the government is going. And we'll probably be surprised. |
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| JM |
Is there anything else that you'd like to... |
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| CW |
No, other than I do believe we are moving toward a more gentle time probably when people
are beginning to realize there are some very grave problems. And it's probably easier to educate and employ than it is to keep our prisons so full because we do that very well, you know. And it's very expensive. |
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| JM |
Well, thank you very much Mrs. Washington. |
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| CW |
That's all right. I don't know if it's served any purpose. |
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| JM |
It certainly has. |
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| CW |
There is one program now that is worth mentioning and that is the fact that the younger members of the NAACP have a mentor program wherein they are attempting to move into the schools that do not have many Black teachers. Very few Black men teachers. Where they are bringing people into the schools to visit with them, talk to the students in such a way as they will have a different opinion of Black people. That they will know that there are professional Blacks and that there are educated Blacks. There are people of some distinction who have been able to accomplish their goals in every day life even though they are not white. I think that is one of the nicest things that's happened in the recent years. |
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